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Jul 29, 10 - 03:52 pm Comment from: Tiger Leopard

Everything is Obama's fault....

Great argument.

An excellent point.

Disregard who said it for a moment, and then ask... Are these not somewhat valid points?

Well the Federal gov't and the union does own GM, at least until they do a new public offering.

No not everything is Obama's fault. Just his anti-business, ultra spending, tax raising, soak the rich mentality.

He can't blame Bush anymore.

Okay, before all the shit starts I wanted to get this in. The reason for tax credits on vehicles is to help the auto industry recover. The reason for tax credits on new technologies like alternative energy vehicles is to make them more enticing to people. The reason for tax credits on construction equipment is to make them easier to afford for companies who can hire people to work. The reason for tax credits in general is to provide an incentive to do things.

The reason there is no tax credit for an iPhone, but you can get a write off for a computer is that smart phones are not yet seen as primary computing platforms. However, I write off my apple purchases as business expenses every year because they help me do my job. And I am damn sure that rush limbaugh's company writes off every piece of electronics in that studio.

Tax credits provide incentive to push things forward, that's why they are typically present when new or essential technologies first come to market. Btw: trucks still have tax credits, gas guzzling trucks. So there.

Oh oh, he's off his meds again.

Valid point. He's right. And no I'm not. Rush fan.

Like I give a flying f*uck what that fat, drug-addicted, five-time marrying, hypocritical Obama-hater thinks.

Let's see how well the iPhone would be selling if not for subsidies. Yes, I know it sold quite well unsubsidized out of the gate, but that was before the Android phones started rolling out. Ten bucks says that an unsubsidized iPhone would stand absolutely no chance against the Android onslaught.

Once again Limbaugh opens his mouth and spews sh!t in amongst his stupidity.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:01 pm Comment from: ron

Objectivity, I will regard who said it. This man is right on. If people would listen to him and watch Glenn Beck, they'd see where the country is headed with this oaf in charge - into the toilet.

$41 grand indeed - ridiculous! Electricity comes from coal.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:01 pm Comment from: Deus Ex Technica

When you can't compete on quality, you gotta compete on price.

Of course, GM isn't the first company to offer rebates in exchange for mediocrity...

Jul 29, 10 - 04:03 pm Comment from: ron

spj. Take your head out of your a-se.

@apple to apples

Great point. The iPhone does get a subsidy. Again...so there! Also, rush...coal and oil companies get giant government subsidies every year and have for the better part of a century. The us government and military is also the largest consumer of fossil fuels on the planet, so in addition to the subsidies, they purchase their gas from those companies also. Double whammy.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:07 pm Comment from: gmsquires

As usual Mr. Limbaugh shoots off his mouth and doesn't get it. This is nothing more than a thinly veiled political attack on Obama. Leave Obama out of this as it has nothing to do with the goverment assist to GM. The tax credit is being offered for electric and electric hybrid cars just as was done previously for Toyota's Prius and Honda Civic and some other hybrids when they came out. They idea my dear Mr Limbaugh and all of your "Ditto Heads" is to encourage cleaner vehicles and reduce dependence on oil to them terrorists in nations over there in the Mid East.

This dingdong 'figurative' is sooo clueless. And your political alternative would be McCain?
Yeah, right.
There's no hope for folks like him/her.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:08 pm Comment from: Geo B

Wow guys, if you can't defeat someone's argument, just call them names? Disagree with anyone's politics but keep the name calling to yourselves.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:12 pm Comment from: Mac4lfe

So my tax money goes to support a product that can't make it on it's merits alone. Welcome to socialism.

@ron...exactly...Rush and Glenn back call it as they see it and they both agree that Obama has perpetrated one of the biggest cons in American history by getting people to vote for him...he's taking your country right down the toilet...40k is ridiculous anyway and 33k makes no difference. when they are 10k maybe then they willa ctually sell...

Jul 29, 10 - 04:14 pm Comment from: macnut222

It would be interesting to hear what he says when congress gets rid of tax credits to the oil companies, or for outsourcing.

Mark Twain didn't go far enough in his quote. There are lies, damn lies, statistics and politics. Is what he should have said. If he thinks Obama is ruining this country why doesn't he just leave. I don't hear any complaints about the bailout of the banking industry except for the government being too restrictive. The same tax credit is also going to Japanese electric vehicles from Nissan and others. Why pick on just Chevy?

Jul 29, 10 - 04:15 pm Comment from: MidWest Mac

Glenn Beck = fear monger.

I rarely agree with Limbaugh, but he entertains me from time to time. Beck does far more damage to this country than any current politician.

@Voice of reason:

+1

...and then add in that none of apple's products are made in the USA while the Volt is....its called investing in the country

In general, tax credit is the method the government uses to coerce or bribe people or organizations. Although I use tax credits as much as possible I wonder sometimes what it would be like without them.

If the government would stop taxing, everybody would have extra money to do what they want. That's what I call freedom. Taxation enslaves people. Tax credits coerce.

If alternate "anything" works it would not need a tax credit.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:18 pm Comment from: Macromancer

@OBjectivity
No they are not valid. Because there doesn't need to be an incentive for people to buy iPhones.

Yet our future energy independence (an maybe our survival) relies on having new and alternative means to power our automobiles and homes, so a tax incentive is a great way to help those alternatives become more established.

I support this idea and hope it takes off. Competition in the marketplace is good, let the energy providers have that competition and maybe even more options become available to consumers.

Much technology and future consumer products start out as government funded projects.

Rush is retarded. The Internet was a DARPA project funded by the government. The iPhone runs on UNIX which was developed with government funding at Bell Labs. Motorola invented (Cooper) the cellphone based on radio technology that came out of government funded projects - Motorola developed the first mobile police car radio, the first mobile backpack radio systems for World War II... The first words spoken from the moon were carried over Motorola equipment.

Get this know nothing windbag off the air. He is misleading with ignorance and it's not good for the public.

I'll take take Mcain Palin any day over monkeybiy and his commy comrades.

They would have probably won, if dems hadn't instigated their traditional October surprise to the fullest effect and taken down the world economy down with them.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:19 pm Comment from: marko

INSANE STUPIDITY

Tax credits are used to support new expensive technologies so they can become mainstream, especially when the entire petrochemical industry, also supported by government subsidies, is poised to attack and undermine any efforts at new competition.

Those of you in support of Rush Limbaugh need to clean out that goo between your ears.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:20 pm Comment from: Macromancer

themacguy

Rush and Glenn Beck only say what they say because they know it panders to their base, which are generally people who are frightened by people and lifestyles that are different than theirs. They will exaggerate and exacerbate any situation if it means their listeners will continue to tune in.

Last I checked, the iPhone IS heavily subsidized by AT&T. The adoption rate of the original iPhone would have been abysmal had it not been.

Glenn Beck speaks the truth. He does far more to protect this country than the majority do. Rush is awesome too. Glenn Beck points out exactly what these Maobama people's backgrounds are and what they are really up to. Maobama and friends try like crazy to hide who they really are. Why not just admit it. They are communist-socialist-marxists-capitalism hating-america haters. Those who are paying attention absolutely know this. Most others are catching on quickly and will really catch on in the next couple of years when they feel the immense pain of new taxes and spending. No one was behind bank bailouts and Auto bailouts besides government and unions. Vote them all out and conservatives in in 2010 and 2012!

Sometimes products are sold at a loss until enough volume can cover large fixed costs. It might be that there is a price point that would move these cars, but initial costs keep the producer from reaching this point. Kind of like the iPhone. The initial cost (sans subsidy) kept a lot of people from getting it, but at a lower price point (via subsidy) they are snatched up.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:29 pm Comment from: HMCIV

Dear Rush,

As a Jeep/Ford guy, I would be more than happy to let Chevy sink on its own feet. To heck with American icons!

Wow, you Marxists really don't hide who you're most afraid of, the people who expose you for who you really are. Sad times we live in. We won't let you people destroy the US. We need to lock down our borders from ILLEGAL immigration immediately. Inexcusable what's going on.

Republicans = FUD.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:32 pm Comment from: MacBart

Every time Limbaugh, Beck or Fox News is mentioned on MDN, the absolute vitriol and hate from the left is scary! Park your emotions and think logically. Limbaugh is correct about this. Good products don't need subsidies. The will prove their worth in the market place. But, Rush is wrong on another point—it's not just Obama. Both Dems and Republicans are destroying our country with bloated, corrupt government. We had better wake up before it's too late.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:32 pm Comment from: MidWest Mac

@Wally

And you would think that if you lists. To that bs all day. Let me guess, you are big gold investor, too.

One of the first things I would have done is call Steve Jobs in as a consultant to help on the task.

@ Voice of reason

Who says we want and need electric cars for $41,000 (40 miles per charge)? Don't give me the "we are running out of oil" or "the earth has a fever" that data is all based on lies.

You may think your a voice of reason but you have been drinking to much of the Obama Kool-aid.

wmd

Jul 29, 10 - 04:38 pm Comment from: the other steve jobs

This is all George Bush's fault.

Where was Rush when his buddy "Peanut Brownie" Bush was giving $6000 tax credits for buying a Hummer or other large SUV? I don't recall hearing a peep from him then, but the Gov't spent far more on direct tax subsidies for that low-quality, low-mileage garbage in the early 2000's than they ever will on Volts.

Or does Rush think the "free hand of the market" was solely responsible for the large-SUV fad? If so, he must have been smoking his pills again. Look it up.

Governments all over the world are offering inducements to assist sales of electric vehicles. They are doing this to kick start alternative technologies because fossil fuels are getting scarcer.

The USA is blessed because there is more than enough sunlight in the desserts to run the entire country on electricity providing the technology is developed.

The USA is cursed because the Republican Party contains the biggest most ignorant bigots and paid mouthpieces of polluting industries who will stop at nothing to prevent this change. That means legal and illegal as well as gerrymandering.

I'm sorry?
Where was the asshat Limbaugh when the Bush administration made it possible to get as much as 100K in tax credits for buying big ass gas guzzlers like the hummer?

Oh and what does Rush say about "ultra-spending" a TRILLION tax dollars to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, the biggest government subsidies to private contractors and oil/mineral companies since WWII.

Or is it only 21st century technology that shouldn't be subsidized in Rush's book... subsidizing 19th century tech with a hundred times the tax dollars won't raise a word of complaint from Rush, since that's the shite product that his buddies the coal and oil barons are selling.

Practically every single mobile phone sold in the US is subsidised, and that includes the original $600 iPhone (its actual price was over $900, and AT&T subsidy was close to $400 at the time). I can't believe how many people still don't know this, three years later!

The above rant by Rush Limbaugh is incredibly hypocritical. Tax breaks for oil and coal industries are prefectly OK, but god forbid we provide tax breaks for vehicles that dare not use the fuel produced by that oil industry!

Had there not been tax breaks (and other massive favours) for the oil lobby in the US over the past five decades, we would have likely seen development of efficient, lightweight and compact battery technology, powering zero-emission electric cars for at least twenty years. Unfortunately, anyone who dares do any research in this field is forcefully sabotaged by the omnipotent oil lobby. I truly wonder what will happen when the oil runs out in some 40-50 years...

Even if we disregard the scarcity of oil reserves (or choose to believe someone like WMD here that those are all lies...), the amount of pollution to the air we breathe coming out of fossil fuels would have long ago motivated the world to find clean alternatives (sun, hydro, tide, etc), had there not been for the almighty Oil (and coal) dollars.

Most of you are idiots, and quite frankly, I'm shocked to see it show up here.

Bottom line, the cost of fuel is too high. It DOES cause pollution and environmental damage. I have been an advocate for alternative fuels for years before Obama ever thought of taking office... You know, back when it was a good idea that George Bush thought of doing something about it?

Rush doesn't make a good point at all. Tax credits have been around on certain purchases for a long time. Get a tax credit for making your house more energy efficient. Why? Because it doesn't create as much burden on our already stressed energy plants and costs. Get a tax credit on business expenses. Why? So that it makes it more enticing to open your own business and can afford to purchase the equipment to stay in business... By the way, this boosts the economy. Why not get a tax credit on an iPhone? You can! You can count it as a business expense if you use for business purposes.. Why can't everyone have a tax credit on an iPhone? I don't know... Why don't you get a tax credit for buying movie tickets? Because they're not necessities, they're luxuries.

And while it can be argued that the Volt is a luxury, it is still a step in the right direction to draw attention to alternative fuels. For myself, who has to commute every day to work (45 miles) - I wouldn't mind paying just one ways trip of gas.

Maybe the rest of you Obama bashers and hate breeders need to wake up think different, instead of focusing on what the mainstream media and over paid blow-hards want you to think.

Jul 29, 10 - 04:54 pm Comment from: ron

"Let me guess, you are big gold investor, too."

I have 400 krugerands, which are worth a lot of money - UNLESS - 'The Big O' does what the biggest loser did. Roosevelt screwed with gold and destroyed a lot of wealth. Look for 'O' to do it also.

Anyone who says the iPhone is subsidized is WRONG! Look at your AT&T contract. Your paying another 10 bucks a month more which pays for the "so called" subsidy!